Best aftermarket DRL

[Bandit]

Quite a few powerful DRLs on eBay now. They still do not define brilliance in candela, hopefully soon. The Lumens (400 to 700) are enough, we just need to know what candela level, determined by the beam forming components.

I am surprised actually myself at the increase in quality of ebay DRLs- I bought some ECE E Marked DRLs from the UK via ebay and recently have seen a few coming from China that are also E Marked - even down to having the 'RL' stamped on the lens as required by ADR 76. There are still plenty of dodgy ones about, inlduing the DRL 'strips' - what a load of nonsense. I had an email war with one seller the other day who is claiming that his strip light is visible hundreds of metres away and will be complulsory on all Commodores from 2011 onwards

For my lancer I am going to get some Hellas - Part 5607 - which is ADR compliant and will fit nicely where the current (and superfluous) fog lights are. (not sure if this link will work but here goes - http://db.hella.com.au/cgi-bin/catalogu ... maint=2920

[Blakey]

Quite a few powerful DRLs on eBay now. They still do not define brilliance in candela, hopefully soon. The Lumens (400 to 700) are enough, we just need to know what candela level, determined by the beam forming components.

I am surprised actually myself at the increase in quality of ebay DRLs- I bought some ECE E Marked DRLs from the UK via ebay and recently have seen a few coming from China that are also E Marked - even down to having the 'RL' stamped on the lens as required by ADR 76. There are still plenty of dodgy ones about, inlduing the DRL 'strips' - what a load of nonsense. I had an email war with one seller the other day who is claiming that his strip light is visible hundreds of metres away and will be complulsory on all Commodores from 2011 onwards

For my lancer I am going to get some Hellas - Part 5607 - which is ADR compliant and will fit nicely where the current (and superfluous) fog lights are. (not sure if this link will work but here goes - http://db.hella.com.au/cgi-bin/catalogu ... maint=2920

but are those E-marked for Australia tho. there are different E mark numbers for different areas. i dont remember Australians directly or other ones they deem acceptable for use in Australia.

[Bandit]

There is a list of acceptable E mark numbers in ADR 76.

[davmax]

Blakey. Your defintion of the Candela measure is correct. However focusing determines how much light is crammed into the cone ie the flux density (candela) level.

The purpose of a reflector is to gather up the light emitted in all directions and concentrate the flux.

Please check out light intensity curves of LEDs in candela or millicandela, most commonly found in focsed LEDs data sheets. By measuring candela at different viewing angles a graph in candela intensity can be plotted over an arc of angles.

Candela is a candle power measure. A Lux mter can measure Candela at 1 metre 1 Lux = 1 Candela

Why indeed are focused lights specified in Candela such as in the standards?

[davmax]

Quite a few powerful DRLs on eBay now. They still do not define brilliance in candela, hopefully soon. The Lumens (400 to 700) are enough, we just need to know what candela level, determined by the beam forming components.

I am surprised actually myself at the increase in quality of ebay DRLs- I bought some ECE E Marked DRLs from the UK via ebay and recently have seen a few coming from China that are also E Marked - even down to having the 'RL' stamped on the lens as required by ADR 76. There are still plenty of dodgy ones about, inlduing the DRL 'strips' - what a load of nonsense. I had an email war with one seller the other day who is claiming that his strip light is visible hundreds of metres away and will be complulsory on all Commodores from 2011 onwards

For my lancer I am going to get some Hellas - Part 5607 - which is ADR compliant and will fit nicely where the current (and superfluous) fog lights are. (not sure if this link will work but here goes - http://db.hella.com.au/cgi-bin/catalogu ... maint=2920

but are those E-marked for Australia tho. there are different E mark numbers for different areas. i dont remember Australians directly or other ones they deem acceptable for use in Australia.

My understanding is that the E mark number relates to the location of compliance testing authority that issues product approval to the UNECE87 standard. Seeing that ADR76 embraces the UNECE87 I would expect that most E mark testing approvals will be OK. We just do not appear to have a testing authority in Australia.

[davmax]

Back to the DRLs offered by the Chinese on eBay. They specify brilliance in Lumens. The Lumens quoted are not always correct eg a 4 x 1watt LED DRL in one case is claimed as 400 -700 Lumen. A 1 watt LED at 300 mA is typically 70 - 90 Lumen (previously in their specs) at best 100. Lumens are cumulative so 4 x 100 = 400 Lumen. 700 is not real it is a mistake probably made through copying and pasting from more powerful product specs.

When the Lumen value is correct this unfortunately gives no indication of the brilliance in the forward direction which is defined in Candela as required by the compliance specification.

With the assistance of a Chinese friend we are trying to get these products correctly specified. Sellers do not understand what the light values mean or what is required. Lumens come straight off the single LED component data sheet. The Candela value states the performance of the final product.

[Bandit]

Thanks for your input to this thread so far davmax. Can I ask if you are working for an importer or doing this research out of your personal interest?

The DRLs I have bought from the UK (by RING Automotive - http://www.ringautomotive.co.uk/product ... ?prod=2060) are UK stamped (E11 from memory) and even made there as far as I can tell.

[davmax]

Quite a few powerful DRLs on eBay now. They still do not define brilliance in candela, hopefully soon. The Lumens (400 to 700) are enough, we just need to know what candela level, determined by the beam forming components.

I am surprised actually myself at the increase in quality of ebay DRLs- I bought some ECE E Marked DRLs from the UK via ebay and recently have seen a few coming from China that are also E Marked - even down to having the 'RL' stamped on the lens as required by ADR 76. There are still plenty of dodgy ones about, inlduing the DRL 'strips' - what a load of nonsense. I had an email war with one seller the other day who is claiming that his strip light is visible hundreds of metres away and will be complulsory on all Commodores from 2011 onwards

For my lancer I am going to get some Hellas - Part 5607 - which is ADR compliant and will fit nicely where the current (and superfluous) fog lights are. (not sure if this link will work but here goes - http://db.hella.com.au/cgi-bin/catalogu ... maint=2920

I agree Bandit the LED strips are DECORATIONS mainly effective in low light and do not comply with DRL specs in brilliance and mounting. Trying to mimic the production cars without sufficient knowledge I suspect.

You are getting the right product. I will probably sample one of the Chinese products that looks a good prospect. I notice one real weakness in the UNECE87 spec. The DRL only needs to be tested at 23C temperature, that is a joke for hot Australian daytime temperatures, Eurocentric. LED Reliability will be compromised if the product cannot tolerate 50C in Aus.

[davmax]

Thanks for your input to this thread so far davmax. Can I ask if you are working for an importer or doing this research out of your personal interest?

The DRLs I have bought from the UK (by RING Automotive - http://www.ringautomotive.co.uk/product ... ?prod=2060) are UK stamped (E11 from memory) and even made there as far as I can tell.

Have no vested interest as yet. As a retired Electronics Engineer and very familiar with LEDs and their application. I actually made up my own DRL about a year ago and recently considered buying Chinese product to resell. Having dealt with one manufacturer and finding them fall silent when I requested to BUY samples to ensure performance and compliance I became more interested in the detail of compliance and what is being offered.

Will probably buy a sample from eBay offerings. Operating temperature may be an issue it being a critical factor in LED life expectancy.

[Bandit]

If you are looking at Chinese suppliers I recommend Oulondun (www.oulondun.com), unless they are the oens you;ve previously had a problem with !!!??? - I have had some email conversations with them and they have mimicked a Hella LEDayLine product quite well from what I can tell.

[Bandit]

[ Operating temperature may be an issue it being a critical factor in LED life expectancy.

Crumbs, my UK ones probably won;t last as long as I'd hoped in the Aus heat in that case... oh well.

[davmax]

If you are looking at Chinese suppliers I recommend Oulondun (www.oulondun.com), unless they are the oens you;ve previously had a problem with !!!??? - I have had some email conversations with them and they have mimicked a Hella LEDayLine product quite well from what I can tell.

Thanks Bandit. Had a look at specs. They are still doing what all Chinese want to do. They only specify the Lumen output of one component LED
ie 70-90Lumen. I managed to get one lot to understand that 5 x 90 Lumens is 450Lumen and they now quote a total lumen range. There is no spec for the finished product ie forward focused light intensity in candela as required. Just leaves one hanging, just wandering at what level do they fit within a range of 400 to 1200 candela.
Perhaps they do not know how to measure the final candela value!!!

[Blakey]

Blakey. Your defintion of the Candela measure is correct. However focusing determines how much light is crammed into the cone ie the flux density (candela) level.

The purpose of a reflector is to gather up the light emitted in all directions and concentrate the flux.

Please check out light intensity curves of LEDs in candela or millicandela, most commonly found in focsed LEDs data sheets. By measuring candela at different viewing angles a graph in candela intensity can be plotted over an arc of angles.

Candela is a candle power measure. A Lux mter can measure Candela at 1 metre 1 Lux = 1 Candela

Why indeed are focused lights specified in Candela such as in the standards?

that bit you noted on intencity of light into that small cone, that i was unaware of, but your thing there is actually incorrect, its
1m^2 x 1 Lux = 1 Candela

but in the same sense

1M^2 x 1 Lux = 1 Lumen

only different is 1 uses distance^2 other uses area of portrayed light determined by the distance.

In that sense 1Candela = 1 Lumen, But it does not = that, as you have stated,


and if you know the angle of the light you can work out the candelas

candela is only how bright it looks in a small angle, not how bright it actually is, you can have next to no brightness, but highly focused, it will look bright, but its not actually bright.



Here is a table that gives angles, and cd/lm
just get your Lumens then times the cd/lm number to get a estimate of candela

beam angle........cd/lm
5.....................167.22
10...................41.82
15...................18.60
20...................10.48
25...................6.71
30...................4.67
35...................3.44
40...................2.64
45...................2.09

so if you have 200lm at 15 degrees, you go 200x18.60 and you get 3720Cd

Most LED lighting that has greater then mcd milicandela are expressed in Lumens. as with most thing that have a large viewing angle.

you can also get Lumens from candela, by dividing the cd/lm number, the same way.

also unless they are all focued there cd will be one for each not a total of all of them, so if there is 5 led's in the unit, each have there own lense, then they will have 5 cd numbers, unless they are all focused in the same lense

hope that helps

[davmax]

Blakey. Your defintion of the Candela measure is correct. However focusing determines how much light is crammed into the cone ie the flux density (candela) level.

The purpose of a reflector is to gather up the light emitted in all directions and concentrate the flux.

Please check out light intensity curves of LEDs in candela or millicandela, most commonly found in focsed LEDs data sheets. By measuring candela at different viewing angles a graph in candela intensity can be plotted over an arc of angles.

Candela is a candle power measure. A Lux mter can measure Candela at 1 metre 1 Lux = 1 Candela

Why indeed are focused lights specified in Candela such as in the standards?

that bit you noted on intencity of light into that small cone, that i was unaware of, but your thing there is actually incorrect, its
1m^2 x 1 Lux = 1 Candela

but in the same sense

1M^2 x 1 Lux = 1 Lumen

only different is 1 uses distance^2 other uses area of portrayed light determined by the distance.

In that sense 1Candela = 1 Lumen, But it does not = that, as you have stated,


and if you know the angle of the light you can work out the candelas

candela is only how bright it looks in a small angle, not how bright it actually is, you can have next to no brightness, but highly focused, it will look bright, but its not actually bright.



Here is a table that gives angles, and cd/lm
just get your Lumens then times the cd/lm number to get a estimate of candela

beam angle........cd/lm
5.....................167.22
10...................41.82
15...................18.60
20...................10.48
25...................6.71
30...................4.67
35...................3.44
40...................2.64
45...................2.09

so if you have 200lm at 15 degrees, you go 200x18.60 and you get 3720Cd

Most LED lighting that has greater then mcd milicandela are expressed in Lumens. as with most thing that have a large viewing angle.

you can also get Lumens from candela, by dividing the cd/lm number, the same way.

also unless they are all focued there cd will be one for each not a total of all of them, so if there is 5 led's in the unit, each have there own lense, then they will have 5 cd numbers, unless they are all focused in the same lense

hope that helps[/code]

I see you like a good argument.

Lets take the first point. 1 candela = 1 lux x 1 sq metre

It is not necessary to measure the light intensity over the whole area
So measuring the lux level at 1 metre distance will be sufficient.

As far as your tables are concerned they are correct and define the intensity within the enclosed angles. As the angle narrows so does the intensity in Candelas increase ( ie focused flux intensity) all without changing the Lumen value. So focus does indeed increase Candelas as stated and you demonstrate.

With a 5 LED assembly the matter is complex in that the individual light intensity beams will combine at some outgoing point. Best measured.

I believe that I have explained enough. You need to accept that those creating the standards know what they are doing when they specify light intensity in candela.

[draevon]

Another thread destroyed ......